Draymond Green seems well-equipped to handle life after the NBA already. He’s established himself as one of the more prominent player personalities and has joined a slew of others in creating their own podcasts. The Draymond Green Show encapsulates mostly stream-of-consciousness topics around basketball, the Warriors, and sometimes just life itself.

Green recently was asked via an open Q&A who his top 5 defenders of all time were. He started off by saying that he was not old enough to remember Bill Russell, who he’d be leaving off the list for that reason, although he clarified that he and others around the league have the “utmost respect” for Russell’s contributions to the game.

He also made sure his thoughts on all-time conversations clear, saying he doesn’t like them because it’s almost impossible to compare in eras you don’t have experience in. This is a sentiment echoed by a lot of players regarding these debates, as it’s impossible to really compare different times in basketball. Everything requires context, but context is often lacking when these debates are had.

Regardless, however, on Dray’s list was: Gary Payton, Tony Allen, Ben Wallace, himself, and Dennis Rodman. Green said that initially he would have put Scottie Pippen on the list, but because of Pippen’s antics as of recent, he couldn’t give those credence in good faith.

He also clarified that, although Ben Wallace was a great shotblocker, he was not on the list because he blocked shots. Rather, it was Wallace’s talent as a post defender that gave Draymond reason to include him on the list.

“Wallace played during a time period when they were dumping the ball into the post” Green said before naming a number of players Wallace guarded while being undersized as a center, much like Green himself. “It does not make you a great defender because you block some shots.”

This seems like a pretty solid argument in favor of Wallace, but it could also easily be a dig at Rudy Gobert. It seems that way, of course, because that’s primarily what Gobert is known for. That’s what he does. He doesn’t excel at really any other part of defense but he gets the credit for it because he blocks a lot of shots.

Green has had a bit of a rivalry with Gobert in the past over the Defensive Player of the Year award. Gobert has won it three times now, while Draymond has won the award twice despite probably deserving a few more of them. His versatility makes him capable of guarding any position on the floor, and his game IQ is the driving force behind the Dubs’ #1 ranked defense. Gobert, while he does anchor the Jazz on that end to a degree, really has a tether on how far he can go out before a guard gets him on a switch and exposes him. Draymond doesn’t have a weakness like that.

This list also notably includes Gary “The Glove” Payton, father of Green’s teammate Gary Payton II. The Young Glove has been an excellent defender this season, a revelation even as the 15th man on the roster. He’s improved as a shooter in just a few games, and has brought a lot of hustle and energy that the Warriors need off the bench.

A defender who’s earned his reputation probably more than anyone else in the league today, and who’s resume alongside a good old eye test could tell you he has a case to be the greatest defender of all time, Draymond’s opinion on this matter is something that should be given a lot of credit. If there’s one guy in the modern era who knows defense like nobody else, it’s Draymond Green.

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